Topics: Pollie Pedal, Pentagon report into AUKUS, Gaza peace plan, charter letters

 

E&OE

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Angus Taylor, welcome to the programme.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Great to be with you, Mel.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Now you've come to us from the Pollie Pedal, the annual charity ride. You've been going through regional South Australia. Tell me about the money you've been able to raise with this ride.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, that's right, almost 1000 kilometres through regional South Australia, the Clare and Barossa Valleys, and we were raising money for the Wandering Warriors, which is a group that supports our Special Forces veterans as they leave military life and go out into civilian life, which can be really challenging in many cases and this is support for education out into civilian life, a fantastic cause. We've raised about a quarter of a million dollars. Over the life of Pollie Pedal, since 1998, it's raised $7 million for many different wonderful causes. Really proud to have been part of it this year and for many years, and it was particularly good supporting our Special Forces veterans, many of whom who rode with us as well, and they were good value.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Oh, fantastic. That sounds like a really worthwhile cause and good to keep the body moving, while politics gets the mind moving. Certainly, got it all covered. So, look, let's go to some of those political issues. We've seen in the last couple of days, there's been some international reporting suggesting that the Pentagon's report into AUKUS gives the green light to it continuing. Look, if that bears out, would that be the good outcome that you were looking for?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, we certainly want to see the US as part of AUKUS. There's no AUKUS without the US, Mel. But we also have to make sure that we're doing our bit to make AUKUS work effectively, and that means properly funding our defence force – our ADF – it hasn't been properly funded if AUKUS is to succeed, and other parts of our military are to be fully funded. It's clear from experts, like ASPI, that we need to get to 3% of GDP on conventional measures if we are to support both AUKUS and everything else the ADF has to do. And we have to be in a position where we are prepared for conflict. The purpose is peace, of course, but you only achieve peace through deterrence, and we're clearly facing the most dangerous circumstances since the Second World War.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

So, the government's argument would be, what matters is what you spend the money on. So, are you in a position to nominate, you know, which specific bits of hardware or development that you would want to spend that extra funding on?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, sure. You know the government's own Defence Strategic Review has laid out where the money needs to be spent, and experts are telling us that that is at around 3% of GDP. So that obviously includes AUKUS Mel, which does need additional spending, and not just the submarines. It's also the infrastructure to support that, at Henderson in WA, Osborne and Stirling. They need significant investment if they're to be adequate for what we need, but there are other areas that need serious funding as well.

 

We don't have the people in the ADF that the government itself is targeting. We don't have the innovative technologies that is very clear are needed in conflict now. For instance, drone technology, which we haven't been funding to the level we need to, missile technology, and it is very clear, if we're to stand on our own two feet, we also have to have sovereign manufacturing in key areas, and that hasn't been funded as well. So, there's a whole range of areas that are underfunded. Sustainment of our existing equipment is clearly underfunded, ASPI has told us all of this, and many other experts as well. And this government needs to get serious not just about funding AUKUS, but everything else that we need at this time. If we're to be prepared, we're to have the readiness that the government's own strategic review tells us we need.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

The Coalition went to the last election promising to fund more Joint Strike Fighters that the government had cancelled. Is that a procurement you would still want to undertake?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, we'll lay out all the details of our plan in advance of the next election. I've given you an indication of the sorts of areas that we think do need funding. There'll be more detail to follow, obviously. But you know, the important point here is the current level of funding will not be able to both fund the existing defence force to the level that's needed, as well as AUKUS, which clearly is a big funding commitment.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

But how soon can you give us some of that policy detail of specifically what you think the funding needs to be spent on, because I think if we look at the last election, it's a fair assessment to say that lack of policy detail in some areas didn't help with the electoral outcome. So, is it something that you will leave to quite close to an election campaign, or is it something you can flesh out in the next six to 12 months?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Mel, I'm not going to make announcements on this programme today, obviously, on timing or such. Although I've given you a pretty good indication of the areas we're focused, on and will continue to focus on those areas. But the starting point is that the government's own defence strategic review, which laid out a lot of these areas – much of which I'm talking about now – are very clearly. And the real problem is this government is not even funding what its own strategic review told it to fund and we're seeing the consequences of that. I mean, we are clearly under funding the maintenance or sustainment of our existing equipment. There is no ambiguity about that, we’ve seen that in a series of reports.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Yeah, great. Can I move on? Because we've got a lot of ground to cover today. We have the 20-point peace plan that the American and Israeli governments have announced. Do you think that is our best chance of getting a cease fire in Gaza?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

I do Mel, but obviously the prerequisite is that Hamas agrees to it. Israel has already agreed to it, obviously, and we've got other Arab states, critical Arab states, like Saudi Arabia and Egypt and Jordan, who are supporting it, and that gives it a very good chance of success. But it will require Hamas to agree to it, and I think that is critical. I think it's important that the supporters of Hamas do everything they can to make sure that Hamas comes to the table and agrees to this, because it is our best chance and I think it's a big step forward. I do think it was completely putting the cart before the horse to recognise Palestine before an agreement like this was put in place.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Can I ask you about that? Because the Prime Minister has suggested that the peace plan was in part motivated by the momentum that had been created by countries recognising Palestinian statehood. Do you accept the argument that Netanyahu agreed to the plan because of increasing international pressure?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Absolutely not. I mean, it's been led by the United States that hasn't recognised Palestine. I mean, that’s an extraordinary claim to make and the truth is…

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

So why do you think the US shifted then, because the US hadn't pushed Netanyahu to this kind of plan before? So, what do you see that motivated the US to push for this?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

No publicly Mel, and you and I don't know what conversations have been happening behind closed doors. But obviously to have such a detailed agreement as this 20-point plan, there's a lot in that plan. I've been through it. Clearly, they've been working on it for some time, and I do think this gives us our best chance of peace. I think it gives us our best chance of a two-state solution. But you know, the problem with recognising Palestine before this goes into place, and before we can see it's working, is it's just provided an incentive for Hamas to not agree to it. Now we hope, and all of us, I think, hope, that Hamas does agree to it, and that is the best outcome, I think, for everybody. But the truth of the matter is, I don't think that that recognition decision by the government has provided any support at all to get to these outcomes.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

So, I'm really curious to know what you think did provide a change, because they may well have been working on this plan for a while, but Benjamin Netanyahu has been quite firm in not wanting to agree to anything that recognises even the possibility of Palestinian statehood, which this 20-point plan does. So, something has changed. What do you attribute it to?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, Mel, again, I would push back on that. Benjamin Netanyahu has been very clear that some kind of peacekeeping force that includes support from the Arab states, like Saudi Arabia and Egypt and Jordan, was a pathway to peace, and to coexistence of Israel and Palestine. So, he has said that in the past. I've heard him say it in interviews. So, I think this is the right path forward. It's clearly been something that's been worked on for some time. I think it's important that across the globe pressure is put on to make sure this agreement has its very best chance of success, and I think it's crucial that Hamas now accept it, and if they don't, the consequences will be continued war. None of us want to see that.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Can I move on to some domestic matters? We've seen reporting today that Sussan Ley has written to all of her frontbench ministers, giving them something like a charter letter that you might get if you were in government. Did you get one of those letters?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, yeah, it's the sixth charter letter I've had, and I welcome them, and I think they're a good thing, and I strongly support that process.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Is it a reminder from the Leader to focus on your portfolio area? Or for everyone to focus on their portfolio area?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, I focus on my portfolio area every day because I want to see appropriate funding of our defence force. I want to see a plan in place that ensures that we have the readiness and preparedness to deal with the most dangerous strategic environment since the Second World War, and I want to see that we've got a military that is capable of fighting and winning wars. Not because we want war, but because we want peace, and that that will continue to be my focus every single day. I support charter letter processes. As I say, I've been a Cabinet Minister and Shadow Cabinet Minister for many years now, so I'm familiar with them. I think they're a good thing.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Are your colleagues sufficiently focused on their portfolio areas, particularly Andrew Hastie?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Look, I'm not going to get into commentary on colleagues. I think if we are to be competitive at the next election, and ultimately to win the next election, we need to ensure that we're working on those policies that matter to Australians, that make our nation stronger and put Australians in a better position to realise their own aspirations, and that's what I'm going to continue to do every day Mel.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Are issues that Andrew Hastie has been raising, like migration, auto manufacturing, fertility rates? Are they those kinds of issues that the party needs to be focused on?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, there's lots of issues we need to resolve in the lead up to the next election, and I mean, it's clear that that includes energy policy. I don't think there's any debate about that. Obviously, this is a difficult area. It's an important area for Australians. Australians want reliable, affordable, sustainable energy, and I'm going to continue to engage in those debates in the right forums, obviously, and that's important if we're going to be competitive in the next election.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Which are the right forums?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, Mel, look, you know, I'm not going to get into commentary on colleagues, which is what you, I know you, you're encouraging me to do…

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

I'm leading the horse to water, Angus Taylor.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

But look these issues really matter. Australians are seeing a Labor government that is failing them, an economy that is not performing as it should. It's not growing in a way that's delivering prosperity. It's clear now that inflation and high interest rates are not going to get to where we want them to, according to even Michele Bullock over the last little while, and so that is costing all Australians. So, we need good policies, and we need to have a Shadow Cabinet that's working those through over the coming months and years.

 

MELISSA CLARKE:

 

Alright, Angus Taylor, we'll leave it there. Thanks very much.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Good to be with you.

 

ENDS.