Topics: Thai cuisine, Liberal Party, energy policy, net zero

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

Let's return to politics now and joining me from Sydney is the Shadow Defence Minister, Angus Taylor. Thanks very much for your time, as always. I won't ask what your Thai dish of choice was, but you generated a bit of news having dinner with Andrew Hastie. Is Sussan Ley safe in the job?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Kieran, that's a dinner that I have regularly in multiple places. I love a green curry, though. I do love a good green curry with a bit of spice to it – it's always good. There were many people, a significant group, at that dinner. And look, I do – as all of us should do – talk to my colleagues all the time about lots of issues. We've got plenty to talk through, and we do. It's incredibly important that we debate the issues that we need to work on, and most of all, debate how we're going to beat a bad Labor Party at a time when we're seeing them drive up energy prices, interest rates are not coming down as expected, and the economy is sclerotic. We're looking down the barrel of stagflation: rising inflation and rising unemployment at the same time, which is the worst of all possible worlds. So, we're going to keep talking about these things, Kieran, and making sure that we're in a position – which we need to be – to hold a bad Labor government to account.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

Do you believe you'll get to a position that all your Liberal colleagues will be satisfied with?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

I absolutely believe we can get to a unified position. I assume you're talking here on energy policy.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

On net zero.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

I really do believe we can. Because I think what we’ve got is a very strong, unified view across the Party that we need to bring down emissions as fast and as far as we can using technology and choice – not taxes, not heavy-handed government regulation and subsidies. That will bring down emissions substantially and at a good pace. But we need to do it, most importantly, in a way that's not going to be destructive to our economy and is going to be achievable. Right now, Labor has told us that their own plan can only be achieved by imposing a massive carbon tax on the economy – over ten times Julia Gillard's carbon tax, almost $300 a tonne, Kieran – and that's a disaster for Australians. It will drive up the price of electricity, the price of food, the price of building materials, the price of cars. That's completely unacceptable. I'm completely opposed to it, and I think we can land a sensible, unified position on what is a difficult issue. It's a difficult issue not just for us in the Liberal Party, it's a difficult issue for Australians because they're being hurt by bad Labor policies right now.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

When you were the Minister responsible for energy, you spoke about the need to have supply, supply, supply, and that is obviously the question at the moment in terms of gas. Can it come on quickly enough? I wonder – do you believe, though, that with your policy framework, that you can get a deal, a situation where you still satisfy some of the demands of your more moderate colleagues who want to stay in the international framework?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, I mean, the National Party has said that they want to stay in the Paris Agreement. We're still working through our position, but I think that's a very strong signal – and an answer to your question – from them at least, Kieran. But the important thing is this: we need to bring down emissions as fast as we can without imposing costs on hardworking Australian households, without weakening our economy. That means we've got to use technology and choice. I've long believed in this approach – this is not new from me. In fact, we went down the "technology, not taxes" pathway a number of years ago. It is still the right answer. And the important point here is that you don't drive up the price of electricity as Chris Bowen has. You know, the extraordinary thing, Kieran, is that when I was minister, we brought down prices by 10% and emissions by 10%. Since Chris Bowen has been minister, emissions have barely moved and prices have skyrocketed. This is a disaster for Australians. It's because he doesn't understand what you've got to do to make it work. He thinks big government is the answer to everything and that approach is failing Australians.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

When you look at the options, though, beyond gas, you could lift the moratorium on nuclear. But would anyone really build a coal-fired power station today in Australia?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, there is no question that coal will continue to play a big role. Even the states – you know, these are Labor states, very left-wing Labor states like Victoria – they talk a big game about how coal’s got to go. And you know what? Quietly, in a back room, they're doing very expensive deals where they're held to ransom because it's all happening behind closed doors to keep coal-fired power stations going. I mean, coal is going to continue to play an important role in our grid for many years to come, as will gas. You can get a lot more gas into our network if you get your policy settings right, you get more gas out from under the ground.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

Would investors build a coal plant?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Well, you know, whether they would or not, we've got a lot of coal already in the system, Kieran, and we need to sweat those assets – make the most of them – and make sure we don't ever take them out without a replacement. Of course, I had a strong focus on that as Minister. That's why the Kurri Kurri gas generator – which Chris Bowen opposed for a substantial period of time before he realised he needed it – then he thought he was going to put green hydrogen into it, and now he's realised he can't. I mean, this guy hasn't got a clue. He really doesn't. There is a pathway forward here. It's using the full suite of technologies. It is, as you say, about getting more supply into the system, and I am very confident that can achieve the outcomes Australians want to see – which is affordable, reliable energy – as we bring emissions down at a responsible rate in line with our peers.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

So, you support Narrabri and more gas exploration in New South Wales, as the Minns Government is pursuing?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

I absolutely do. In fact, I was the minister when we managed to convince the last New South Wales government – the Liberal government – to approve the Narrabri resources, and that's incredibly important. But we need to do much more than that. I spent a lot of time up in the Beetaloo. We've got to get that moving. We've got to make sure we get the most out of the Surat Basin. I think there's more potential down in Victoria – certainly offshore – and if this government ever got its act together in Victoria, onshore as well. I mean, all of these are sources of energy which are going to bring down prices. They'll bring down emissions too. This is the extraordinary thing: Labor put all its money on green hydrogen – not going very well. They were also using gas to produce hydrogen, which we do now when we produce fertiliser en masse, Kieran. These are proven technologies, but Labor simply rules them all out. And the result is what we're seeing now: rising prices, emissions aren't coming down, and a completely failed minister that puts all his faith in government rather than in the hardworking Australian people and the technologies they're producing and want to see used.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

And is Sussan Ley safe in the job?

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

Yeah, I mean, I think she's going to continue on, to get through this issue, and take us to the next election. That's what she's seeking to do, and I support her as a leader, as you know.

 

KIERAN GILBERT:

 

Angus Taylor, thanks. Talk to you soon.

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:

 

It's good to be with you.

 

 

ENDS.