Topics: Bondi massacre; antisemitism, hate speech laws; counterterrorism; resourcing for intelligence agencies.

E&OE

LAURA JAYES:

Let's go straight to the Shadow Defence Minister Angus Taylor, who joins me live from Bondi Beach. Is that right, you're not satisfied with the government's response, Angus?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

That's absolutely right, Laura. Whilst we welcome that they've done something it's too little too late. The warning signs have been there since back in October 2023, of course, and we've seen so many warning signs since, whether it's the graffiti, the firebombing, the intimidation, the harassment, we've seen time and time again, we've seen a government that has been asleep at the wheel. What we need now is concerted, comprehensive action. We do need legislative change. We do need to bolster our counterterrorism capability in this country; we need to focus on the radical Islamism that is the root cause of the antisemitism that we've seen over recent days. This has got to come to an end, Laura, people have had enough, and this government has got to get serious at last.

LAURA JAYES:

So, what was announced yesterday, I think it's really important, and it is a big leap to what was already in place. Are you talking about adding to that, or do you want to see that fast tracked?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Yes. Well, both. We are absolutely talking about adding to that. You know, the threat level was raised mid last year, Laura, we saw ASIO raise the threat level to Probable, and yet there was no additional resources putting in, no changes, no reforms to support that change in threat level, nothing. This government has been asleep at the wheel, and we need to see them get serious. Peter Dutton has made this point this morning. We made this a point with the announcements yesterday. This is a government that has been asleep at the wheel since October 2023, and they're still not getting on with what needs to be done in order to alleviate the situation and to make sure that, first of all, we don't see a repeat, and second of all, we deal with the underlying problem here, which is this radical Islamism, this antisemitism, which has been rampant and has been tolerated. If it goes unchallenged, it will continue. It's as simple as that.

LAURA JAYES:

Okay, so the hate speech laws will be strengthened. The threshold will be lifted. I'm not quite sure what that threshold is. Tony Burke said, you know, they're going to legislate particular phrases like ‘Globalise the Intifada’. Is that fair enough? Where should that threshold be in your view?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Well, if it's inciting violence, it shouldn't be happening. I think that's pretty…

LAURA JAYES:

But what's the definition? Is it straightforward? I mean, I'm not being cute here. But is it that straightforward? Is it the inciting violence part of it, or should the threshold be even lower than that?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Well, what's clear is that it should include inciting violence. I would have thought ‘Globalising the Intifada’ is a pretty strong example of inciting violence, Laura and you know, we can get into legal debates over exactly where the threshold should be, and this will be worked through…

LAURA JAYES:

But that’s the whole point of it right? If Sussan Ley is calling on parliament to be recalled to get these laws changed, which you agree with, that's what needs to be settled on, right? So could this really be done before Christmas…

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Of course.

LAURA JAYES:

When you and I are having, well, you and I are having this conversation, you're saying it should include inciting violence. I'm saying, well, it seems like the community is asking for that threshold to be even lower than that. So, is there a position from the Opposition as to what that should actually be? Where's the line?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

The line is to at least include inciting violence, and, of course, making sure that we do not see a repeat of what we have seen in the last few days. Now we need much more.

LAURA JAYES:

What about vilification?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

I mean, the point we've made, well, can I make the point that there's much more legislation that needs to be put in place and this is the point that Sussan Ley made yesterday. So first of all, we need to see legislation to support Jillian Segal's recommendations, which have been on the table for an extended period of time, Laura and we have seen no serious moves from the government to implement that. We also need to see legislation in place to support the counter terrorism work that needs to happen to ensure that there is no repeat of what we have seen this week. We have laid out very carefully, a series of proposals that will deal with those issues, and we need to see that done as quickly as possible. Now the government has no shortage of drafting resources, Laura, to work through these issues, thrash them out. We'll thrash them out with them. We'll sit in the parliament and thrash out the issues you're talking about with the government. We're very happy to do that and to do that as quickly as possible.

LAURA JAYES:

You spoke about counter terrorism and that needing to be bolstered in what sense? Is it funding? Is it personnel? Is it more cooperation with international agencies? What is it?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

All of the above, all of those things are absolutely right.

LAURA JAYES:

Do you think that's not happening now?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

No. Look, we saw the threat level raised to Probable mid last year, and we didn't see the appropriate response in funding and resourcing, in changes necessary to underscore and to deal with that increase in threat level and it was clear. Mike Burgess has said this time and time again that antisemitism has become the major terrorism threat in this country…

LAURA JAYES:

But he hasn't said that he's under resourced though, Angus.

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Well, you know what? We did not see any increase in the funding. I mean, it's as simple as that. Now, who knows what conversations have gone on between him and the government, but we have not seen an increase in funding, Laura, and that's completely unsatisfactory when you've seen an increase in the threat level, and we've seen what's happened now as a result. I mean, look, you could see plainly that antisemitism was on the rise in the country. All of those examples I gave you earlier, the firebombing of the synagogue, the childcare centres, the harassment, the graffiti, we see it, it was in plain sight what was going on here, and yet there wasn't an increase in resourcing necessary to deal with it.

LAURA JAYES:

Just finally, you are at my home, Bondi Beach. It's really hard to describe what it's like down there at the moment. I've been there over the last couple of days; there's a lot of people wanting to talk. They're angry, they're hopeful, they're wanting to pull together as a community. There's a lot of love. How would you describe it?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Look, I was here for the vigil last night, Laura, I don't know if you were here or not, but it was incredibly beautiful. It truly was. The sense of love and community on the back of such tragic circumstances was truly extraordinary. I was moved. I was really touched. I'm a sort of a country boy who's not always emotionally hit by these things, but I was. It was incredibly moving and very beautiful, and I am so appreciative of what the Jewish community is doing here, because I think it's so important, not just for them, but for all Australians…

LAURA JAYES:

I agree.

ANGUS TAYLOR:

That we understand what has happened here, and we celebrate the lives of those victims of this terrible tragedy.

LAURA JAYES:

Yeah, it feels very personal, not just because I live there, but I think to all of us, all of the Australians, and I've seen the emails and the messages I've got absolutely. Hey Angus, I just wanted to, you know, question without notice here, but I'm about to speak to Ed Husic. He is a Labor MP, a Muslim Western Sydney MP, who has great empathy and is a supporter of the Jewish community as well. What do you want to hear from him?

ANGUS TAYLOR:

I think, the same as what we want to hear from all Australians, which is support for the Jewish community at this time, condemnation of completely unacceptable antisemitism and a commitment to make sure that we never see this kind of outcome again. And that's what we want from all Australians. You know, I think this is not about pitting Australians against each other. This is about condemning completely unacceptable behaviour, which is at odds with what we believe in as Australians.

LAURA JAYES:

Yeah, we're all Australians first, absolutely, that comes for anything else, and Ed has certainly demonstrated that in his parliamentary career as have you, Angus. Thanks so much for your time. I appreciate it.

ANGUS TAYLOR:

Thank you, Laura,

ENDS.