Topics:  Peter Dutton’s visit to Israel, Labor’s homegrown inflation, Nuclear energy  

 

E&OE   

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Now, as you know, Ray each Thursday has a chat to the Opposition Leader Peter Dutton. But Mr. Dutton's in Israel and good on him for going there and meeting with Benjamin Netanyahu, amongst others. Someone in Australia's leadership, even though he's not part of the government, having the courage of his convictions and going over there, and meeting with the Israelis. I mean to me, it's astonishing, that the Prime Minister hasn't been there and done something like this. Astonishing. Anyway, well done to Peter Dutton. I think I'll speak to him next Thursday. But given the fact we've had inflation numbers this week, and there's plenty going on, let's have a chat to the Shadow Treasurer, Angus Taylor who I'm delighted to say is on the line. Good morning.  

 

ANGUS TAYLOR: 

Good to be with you, Luke.  

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Nice to talk to you again, Angus. And look, I don't want to get stuck down on this, but I make the observation. Peter Dutton, who has spent a lot of time within the Jewish community, very sympathetic to the fact that we've got anti-Semitism running riot in his country, doing the right thing by what I would call an Australian political leader, engaging with the Israelis, and in fact going there.  

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:  

Yeah absolutely right. And I think you are spot on to say that we haven't seen this kind of leadership from the Prime Minister. But it's important we stand by those in the Jewish community in Australia, who have gone through a very tough time, obviously, since October 7. And we've taken a very strong position, and I think consistent, and a moral position on this issue. We want to see, obviously, we all want to see peace in the Middle East. But first of all, we need to see hostilities ending from Hamas and hostages released and all that sort of thing. And it's great to see Peter Dutton over there, meeting with leaders and importantly, taking our very strong position over there and showing our support for Israel at this very difficult time. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Yeah, I agree. And he met with, I think family members and survivors from those horrific October 7 attacks, which have, I think, shamingly been written out of history by some observing this debate. Good on Peter Dutton for meeting with them. Let's get back to your portfolio issues, including the inflation numbers and what that might mean for interest rates down the track. Firstly, what did you make of the number yesterday? And what does it say about the way the government is managing the economy? You don't need me to tell you that there are people doing it so tough and those with a mortgage are scared witless that there might be a move upwards. Don't know what happens next, maybe you do.  

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:  

Well, they were a terrible set of numbers. We've seen headline inflation rise, and we're the only one of the top 10 advanced countries in the world that since December last year has seen an increase in inflation. Every other country has seen a reduction. And we're stuck, it's stuck at 4%, doesn't seem to be budging. It's Labor's failure to tame inflation, that is becoming very apparent now. The Treasurer is constantly looking for excuses. But the truth is homegrown inflation is raging. The non tradable domestic inflation is running at about just under four times the tradable inflation. And that tells you what's really going on here, which is we've just had the wrong policy settings for Australia. Now, the numbers at the end of the day, I don't need to tell Australians about the numbers because they see, they see those numbers every day. When they go to the supermarket, when they pay their insurance bill, when they pay their energy bill, when they pay for housing, whether it's a mortgage or rent, every Australian is seeing the pain of this inflation. What is clear is we've got interest rates in this country higher for longer. In other countries, we've seen interest rates coming down, not here. And whatever the Reserve Bank does next week, what's very clear is that the pain will continue for Australians for a lot longer. It's not over yet, and there's no end in sight. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

And some of these things will hang over for years, you'd think. I made a point Angus yesterday, about rents, they were featured in the ABS release, and you simply can't have half a million or more new people into the land, wanting and needing somewhere to live, plus Australians looking for somewhere to rent, if they're at that stage of their life that they want a rental property and can't afford to buy one, and you're not building anywhere near the numbers of homes we used to build before the pandemic. You can't expect anything other than rents to go through the roof and I don't know how they come down anytime soon. Angus, as you know, you're not going to build a home or blocks of units or apartments in a couple of weeks, are you? 

 

ANGUS TAYLOR: 

No, exactly right. So I mean, the numbers are stark here and it is just, it's common sense stuff, supply and demand. I mean, we've had population growth in this country, in the two years since Labor came to power of over 1.2 million people, 1.2 million people in two years. And housing has been closer to, housing growth has been close to a quarter of a million. Now, that doesn't add up, you just, you can't do it. Those numbers don't work. We should be seeing population growth closer to half of that, given that housing supply growth. And here's the thing, we've seen such a failure in immigration from this government, that they keep making forecasts and getting them wrong, as they do with inflation, by the way, and there's no end in sight there either. So we'll continue to see these housing shortages, every Australian's paying the price for a government that is inept when it comes to managing and beating inflation. And, you know, this is common sense stuff. If you want to get inflation down, you've got to make sure supply is in balance with demand and in the housing market, with that kind of immigration rate, we're simply nowhere near that. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Now I know the Treasurer makes the point that, and you say you know what we've got to get government spending under control, and he says, well you know, some of that spending is on the age pension increases, does the Shadow Treasurer want us not to do that? Now, I don't think that's the point you're making at all. How does the government pull its head in, and do its fair share of the lifting that'll get the inflation number down? 

 

ANGUS TAYLOR: 

Well, here are the facts. I mean, they're quite stark, Luke. We're seeing growth in government spending over the next two years at 16%. And the economy will grow at around half of that, if indeed, it meets the forecast, and the government keeps getting its forecast wrong, but it doesn't matter. What's clear is spending is growing way faster than the economy. We had a rule in place when we were in government, to grow the economy faster than spending, and that's what we did outside of COVID. And it works. But the government has given up on that rule, it's given up on that strategy. And the result is we're continuing to see raging inflation. And the only reason the government has to pay more indexed pensions, which of course, is something we always supported, is because their own inflation is causing that. It's their inflation! But it's not just spending. I mean, they've got to make sure that they get their immigration policy right, they've got to make sure they get their energy policy right, they've got to make sure they get their industrial relations policies right. We know how to break the back of inflation, because we've done it before. But it does mean getting back to basics. And this is a government that doesn't believe in those common sense sorts of policies, as we talked about on immigration. And so they keep getting it wrong. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Electricity prices, another thing. Now of course, the government's, I think they're handing out 75 bucks a quarter to the energy companies to mask what the real effect is from the increase in prices. So that I guess helps them with their inflation lowering pursuit. But isn't it interesting, now we see in a RedBridge poll this week, that the mother of all scare campaigns against nuclear energy, I don't know if it's been necessarily smashed out of the park. But Australians aren't dumb. They're not going to fall for the scare campaign are they, with a growing number of people supporting the nuclear option. 

 

ANGUS TAYLOR:  

No Australians work it out. I love this country dearly, because you know, given time and given a sensible position being put and we'll keep putting that position on energy policy, I think Australians see the issues for what they are. And we saw that with the Voice debate, for instance. I mean, when we took the position against the Voice that we did, we saw, at that point, only about 35% of Australians were on our side. But over time, the debate played out, and we saw an extraordinary result in that referendum. I think it'll be the same in this energy debate. It's not just about nuclear, it's also about making sure we've got enough gas and that we don't close our coal fired generators early. But nuclear is important, because we're going to see 90% of our baseload power disappear in the coming years, and it's got to be replaced. And if it's not replaced, I'll tell you what, we'll lose industry in this country at a rate of knots. So it's an important debate. It's good to see Australians engaging. I was at a forum in my own electorate on exactly this issue last night and will continue to be out there in the community, talking to them about the importance of getting energy policy right and bringing down energy prices in the process. 

 

LUKE GRANT:

Have you turned your mind to what you might do? And I know there's plenty of time before the election, well, I'm not sure there is, I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up going to the polls before the year's end. But regardless of that, this this automatic increase in taxes and levies that comes around every so often for beer, and I want to focus on Billson's Brewery which has been around it seems forever, and other craft brewers, we've offed a few of them in the last few months. It's automatic increase in taxes there, I think it extends to fuel as well and other areas. Why do that in the middle of a cost of living crisis, why do we have to have the automatic price increase? Isn't that something that you could, you know, pause? I mean, I think to your great credit, the Morrison government did something about fuel excise. But this right now for Australian manufacturers, like for example,  Billson's Brewery, and I think they've gone into voluntary administration, this is not the total picture, but it makes it difficult for the consumer.  

 

ANGUS TAYLOR: 

Well, you're absolutely right. I mean, we're seeing a record level of insolvencies now in Australia, and it's just tragic to see great businesses struggling right now. I'm talking to them all the time, particularly in the hospitality area we're seeing that, construction industry as well, of course, and we've heard some of the tales of what some of these union officials have been doing to businesses. But you know, it's important we take as much pressure off business as we can at a difficult time for them. I mean, the best way to beat these automatic increases in indexation is to bring inflation down. I mean, it's the answer to so many of the problems we're facing right now, Luke. The first port of call has to be to beat inflation. This government has had three budgets, three failed budgets now to deal with the issue. We've had a Treasurer who's spent more time writing long essays on remaking capitalism and putting out so called welfare budgets that ignore mortgage payments. They've been distracted, they haven't been focused on the main game, getting inflation down is the answer to these problems. And ultimately, we know, as I said, we know how to do it, it is back to basics, it's getting the basics right, but this is a government that seems to think it's beyond that. And no doubt we'll go to an election when it suits the Prime Minister, not when it's right for the nation. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

When do you think that'll be? Do you imagine that Jim Chalmers will do a fourth budget, and it'll happen sometime next year? Have you got a gut feel or does something point to an early election in your mind? 

 

ANGUS TAYLOR: 

Well, why would he do another budget when his first three failed anyway. This bloke, each time, it's just all spin, it's all spin with this Treasurer. And so yeah, whether they do another budget or not, there's no sign that they're going to fix this problem. They'll go to the election when it suits them not when it suits the Australian people. As always, with Albanese, it will be a political decision. So I don't know the answer to that. What I do know is that we're going to continue to hold the government to, a bad government, to account. A weak Prime Minister who is not dealing with the issues that Australian households are having to deal with. And I'm going to continue to fight for what I think is the right, common sense policies, whether it's in making sure government doesn't waste unnecessary money on failed referendums, on making sure our immigration policy's in line with housing, making sure that we have an energy grid both for the shorter term and the longer term, that can deliver affordable, reliable energy, and industrial relations policies that are good for all workplaces, good for employees and employers, not just for union officials. 

 

LUKE GRANT: 

Good on you. Great to talk to you Angus. 

 

ENDS.